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Preston Gralla's picture
Preston Gralla

Seeing Through Windows

Microsoft exec: Vista-Capable PCs are "junk"

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Rated +62
198 Votes

Top Microsoft execs have admitted that "Windows Vista Capable" PCs, which can run only the most basic version of Vista, are "junk," with Jim Allchin, then co-president of Microsoft's Platforms and Services Division, saying in an email, "We really botched this."

So reported the Seattle Post-Intelligencer last week in a report about a class action suit, which charges that Microsoft misled consumers into buying the Windows Vista Capable PCs, even though the PCs couldn't run the most important features of the then-new operating system.

The revelations came in a hearing last Friday before U.S. District Judge Marsha Pechman, who will decide whether suit should go forward.

Lawyer Jeffrey Tilden, arguing in favor of the class action suit, read a damning series of emails from Microsoft employees and top executives. Mike Nash, who is now a corporate vice president for Windows product management, wrote in an email message, "I PERSONALLY got burnt...Are we seeing this from a lot of customers?...I now have a $2,100 e-mail machine."

Jim Allchin, who was at the time of the Vista Capable PC push the co-president of Microsoft's Platforms and Services Division, wrote in his mail, "We really botched this...You guys have to do a better job with our customers."

And an unnamed employee wrote in an email, "Even a piece of junk will qualify" to be called Windows Vista Capable.

The employee is right ---- Windows Vista Capable PCs really are junk. They can't, for example, run Aero Glass, which Microsoft touts as one of the most important features of Vista. They also can't run Windows Media Center and plenty else as well.

Microsoft cooked up the Vista Capable bait-and-switch scheme because Vista's release was delayed until after the 2006 holiday buying season. Computer makers were worried that the delay would depress holiday sales. So Microsoft came up with a labelling plan that computer makers could slap on low-end PCs. Anyone buying one of the Vista Capable PCs could get a free or low-cost upgrade to Vista once Vista shipped.

Consumers weren't told, however, that the PCs would only be capable of running Windows Home Basic, a stripped-down, nearly useless version of Vista that is inferior to XP.

The whole scheme was sleazy, and from the emails read in court, it's clear that even Microsoft execs knew it was little more than a bait-and-switch routine. At this point, Microsoft should issue a mea culpa, settle the suit by paying up, and move on. If the company doesn't, expect more similar revelations as the suit proceeds.

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What People Are Saying

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Rated +41
115 Votes

Re: Vista on Dell laptop cannot reboot

I just received my inspiron 1525 laptop yesterday and when I switched it on just now, it would NOT boot. Microsoft, you had better come up with some fix for the Basic Vista or at the very least, offer Vista owners an alternative to download a free version of the XP pro as compensation.

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Rated +6
110 Votes

Well, if ALL you want to get

Well, if ALL you want to get is vista-looking environment, why don't you just better looking for many Windows skinning available out there?

And if you can't get the free one, there is Vista Transformation Pack to save the day. Just googling it, and you will find it right away at Windows X shrine website.

I have been using it for 6 months to skinning my Windows XP from top to bottom, from boot loading screen to Audio themes, from Control Panel to Start Menu, and now is happy for it. And, no, it doesn't take up any resource (it's still the reliable, stable, and lightweight XP that we all know, and the skinning is managed by the XP itself, not by third party application like WindowsBlind or else), except, of course, if you want turn on any resource hogging application to make the environment more similar to Vista such like the sidebar or glass transparency. But for me, just enabling the "Vista Transformation Basic" (it's my term for standard is good. ^^

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Rated +34
128 Votes

I'm still on Windows 98SE...

We all know for a fact that MS has been milking us of cash for the past few decades selling Windows. And Vista seems to be the cream of it all. It could be good, but to use Vista we must spend more...again.

So to avoid this hoopla of WinXP this and Vista that (and its related problems and system requirements), I decided to stick with Windows98SE. Not because I have a PIII laptop with me (since I have the option to go XP), but because I have proven it to be a reliable operating system. It may be "obsolete" (a term MS uses to sell more software...heheh), but it still works like a charm for me. I had it updated to the maximum, and now it's smooth sailing. So what if I can't play the latest games? I don't like them , anyway, because they're no fun. Gone are the days of games as good as the original StarCraft, anyway.

Vista is for eye candy, anyway. IBM was able to sell lots of ThinkPads, despite being deemed to be bland and plain, because of its performance. Vista was able to sell because it has the name "Windows" on it.

In the quest of perfection, Microsoft forgot that along the road to success lies a few potholes; and as a result some of us were duped into buying these "Vista-Capable" PCs.

Rate this
Rated +102
258 Votes

Vista is the biggest joke Microsoft ever created!

I am a technician as well & have been for nearly as long as GregM who is "Happy with Vista" has been on this earth & my list of gripes for Vista is nearly endless.

He is correct about the simple upgrades to run that resource hog Aero desktop, but the BIG question is this... WHHHYYYY? Vista gives you NOTHING of any value to warrant an upgrade. Nothing you don't already have with XP or Media Center except slower performance on the same hardware, more hard drive space gulped up, and less features. I thought this was supposed to be better?? An improvement?? Isn't that what new products are supposed to be? Better? And why are there 5 versions? A Home & Pro would have done nicely...or better yet, JUST ONE! Having all these separate versions where features are "you can have this, but you don't get this now" is ridiculous. People will only use what features apply to them anyway. There's no reason to preempt what they're going to do or WANT to do with the computer in 6 months.

Vista is the biggest joke M$ ever put out even bigger than Mellenium & I can't wait to see it DIE! As a system integrator connecting all brands of operating systems (Macs, UNIX, Linux, SUN & Micro$oft) together, Vista is the WORST. They intentionally broke the SMB connection to UNIX by forcing it up to 2.1 or whatever it is now & thereby have slit their own throat in the big industry. If it's connecting to an older Windows box, it'll fall back to the earlier version, but not for UNIX. They'll never get this lead dirigible to fly doing stupid things like that. The default IPV6 in the IP stack is a ridiculous move as well since home routers & broadband are so common. It slows down the IP stack & creates a bottleneck for network performance to that machine. I know, I know...we're going to run out of IP addresses. They've been saying that for 11 years now & guess what....we still haven't! I believe we haven't BECAUSE of broadband & home routers. I think IPV6 needs to be implemented, but not like this.

Not to mention the UAC is a farse & total nuisance, the 5GB of hard drive space needed to install this bloated PIG is absurd & NEEDING 1GB of RAM to get SIMILAR performance, not better, just similar to a 4-year-old PC with XP ...do I even need to comment? The other HUGE gripe I have is WHY did they deem it necessary to change a system layout they've had for 13 years? Why change the names of Control Panel applets & rearrange the start menu? WTF!!!

Further more, just because it doesn't cost an arm & leg to get a very powerful PC today, it doesn't mean all that power has to be used just to boot the damn thing. I say trim down & streamline the OS so we can have better applications on them. Oh, and by-the-way, software developers & IHVs (independent hardware vendors) are getting sloppy with their coding, too, but that's another rant. There's no way a printer should need 350MB of hard drive space for the application & use 50MB for the driver. THAT'S BULL!

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Rated +22
122 Votes

Well put

Vista's release date will forever be known as the day MS lost its grip as the only OS out there for the masses.

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Rated +68
156 Votes

The best upgrade for Windows Vista

The best upgrade for Windows Vista is Windows XP Pro!

My new Toshiba laptop came with that cancer, (Vista Business) I used it for only 1 week before it got me super annoyed. I took that crap off and re installed a copy of XP Pro. It now runs 100% better and faster than it did with Vista.

No, I'm not a Mac or Linux fanboy, I'm a fan of a good and less annoying OS.

Rate this
Rated +5
63 Votes

I don't buy new PCs, I

I don't buy new PCs, I assemble my own, so I'm lucky in that respect that I don't have crap coming with my PC. I did however get Vista from the Power Together promo Microsoft had last year. I tried to like it; tolerate it even. But they screwed up so much with this release. I'm just glad that I didn't have to pay for it.

Microsoft knew they would be screwing customers and went ahead with it anyway. They need to be nailed to the cross for it.

I wonder what the EU will do about this once the US is done with it.

Rate this
Rated +49
113 Votes

Vista is a Marketing Mess

Vista is just one big marketing screw-up to begin with. Why on earth does there need to be six different versions of it (or is it just five)? Maybe if Microsoft would limit Windows to being an operating system, and quit including things that are properly add-on utilities, they wouldn't have these problems.

Just to clarify what I mean, a media player, for example, has nothing to do with the operation of the computer and shouldn't be included as part of the operating system. If Microsoft wants to offer a bundled package of media applications, that's fine, but they shouldn't be integrated with the OS.

I do recognize that most computer users these days are not exactly system experts, so I have no trouble including basic supporting features such as device drivers and basic printer fonts. For anything else, though, it's easy enough to start an installation program to install the non-system software.

Rate this
Rated -75
281 Votes

Happy with Vista

It's nice to see articles trolling for comment content from anti-Microsoft Mac or Linux fanboys. Since when is not being able to run Aero glass the end of the world? Aero glass is cool, its nice, but I do not always run it. For most of what I, or my customers do, Vista Basic would fit the bill just fine.

That there are junky systems out there built with cheap or improperly speced components in relation to the higher performance requirements of non-Basic Vista is nothing new. I am a 17 year professional system builder and tech. Varied system spec levels has always been avaiable. Big deal! For most of the systems alluded to in the article, the primary shortcoming of the systems could be fundamantally solved with a $60-100 graphics card and/or an additional stick of memory.

If you want Aero glass to run on those systems, that's a simple upgrade. Of course there are probably some low-end systems sold by the major manufacturers that do not even have a video expansion slot from that time period. In that case, you would be limited to a PCI upgrade graphics card (which are still avaiable) or a more meaningful system upgrade. But that situation is not mostly encountered.

What is not discussed in this article is that most decent systems that were purchased in this pre-Vista timeframe will run Vista just fine. It is simply not true to say that all "Vista capable PC's" will not run Vista Premium or Ultimate adequately. Many, if not most, will.

Our customers are not having significant problems with Vista and neither are we internally. But perhaps that is because they bought from us, a small, local professional shop that worked through most of the hardware and software issues for them in advance, rather than leaving them on their own with a box and an instruction sheet from inside the box showing them in diagram form how to open the box and get the system out. (and no real help beyond that except a long wait time call center in Bangalore that is staffed by people with no real, comprehensive knowledge of computers)

Our customers that bought more basic systems understood their hardware limitations because we told them. But for many, Aero glass wasn't something they cared about.

Most XP systems won't run high end made-for-XP games on them without at least a graphics card upgrade. And many won't run right with system resource hogging software like Norton Security Suite. Is this "deceptive" on the part of the system makers? I don't think so.

Rate this
Rated +3
85 Votes

Re: Happy with Vista

"Our customers that bought more basic systems" hmmm.
Its 16 mos after the release to OEMs and this morning I open a new Lenovo X61s (2gb RAM), a model released in September 07, with a nice little sticker that proclaims "Vista Basic." It'll be reloaded with XP, but for those without access to another OS it will be another "$2000 email machine." -Since it won't run enterprise there's no bitlocker, no global imaging, no aero, no MC. This is a very expensive laptop purchased last month that STILL doesn't carry Vista's water, so don't blame this on the customer. Shame on Lenovo, but more to the point SHAME ON MICROSOFT!